A chance to talk to FlatpanelsHD's reviewers.
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By Rasmus Larsen
#1700
Harri wrote:
Rasmus Larsen wrote:
alibiy wrote:And yeah, we plan to review both V20 and VT20 :)
Nice review first of all :) , but do you have any idea when you will get a V20?
Panasonic has told me "in the beginning of April" but it hasn't been confirmed. G20 was a delayed around two weeks.
User avatar
By Rasmus Larsen
#1701
joro_abv wrote:Anyway, there is one absolutely major aspect that need to be considered now, when it comes to Panasonic plasmas - the black levels/automatic voltage adjustment problem of the 2009 range. Obviously it's too early for any observations, but do you have any trustful information on that matter from Panasonic or any other source ?
It seems that it's primarily a US related issue. It's true that plasma panels change in terms of light intensity over time but black levels should only be worsened a tiny bit (theoretically).

There are two aspects; one is the actual change in light output that is reduced over time (LCDs and OLEDs also loose light intensity over time).
Panasonic is trying to compensate by modifying light output based running hour intervals (all manufacturers are, including LG and Samsung). It seems that the backlight stepping is too hard on some sets. Panasonic should probably release a firmware update to fix the too steep 600 hour change. Panasonic told me that the 2010 models have a less aggressive algorithm for changing light output. I don’t know if it’s true but I noticed that the picture menu had a setting called “Panel” that changed nothing. This could be a setting for disabling the algorithm.
The second one is the change over time in phosphor. You can’t really do anything about this but it’s the same issue like on the old CRT TVs.

I have had a 2009 and a 2008 Panasonic plasma here for some time now and see no visible reduction. I also had a 2007 and a 2009 Samsung plasma. Both have been running for some time and I have noticed a minor reduction in light output but no change in black levels.
And about the G20 I haven’t found anything alarming. But I haven’t passed the 600 hour mark yet, so I can’t really say.
User avatar
By Rasmus Larsen
#1702
migube_ wrote: Yet another question:
How would you rate the new IFC, compared to Sony's MotionFlow (100HZz/200Hz) or Philips DNM (100Hz/200Hz) ?
I have seen a V10 next to a Z5500 (200Hz) , and was most impressed with the Sony motion, than the V10 IFC.
It's better than the 2009 and 2008 IFC but personally I actually prefer to turn IFC off. I don't like the Philips too much. I has too many artifacts and makes pictures appear artificial. The Sony frame interpolation is the best one in my opinion.
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By Rasmus Larsen
#1703
cdlg7 wrote:I have a dilema. I curently own a pioneer kuro elite 1150hd (720p model) and I absolutely love it, but it has a slight problem. On the lower right hand corner of the t.v., there is a; what I would describe brown spot, maybe about an inch by and inch that you can see when the panel displays a white background. It is very subtle to the point where you can hardly notice it, but I am always drawn to it when there is a white background. Now, I bought the pioneer through best buy with a 4 year warranty on it and they have already sent to tech to see it, and he determined it was the panel. The problem is Pioneer declined their request for a new panel so the best they can do is give me an exchange. Of course the problem is that they have no more pioneers for sale. My question is, should I return it for a Panasonic G20? Am I going to be disapointed with the difference in picture quality?
I don't know the elite 1150hd because I live in Europe but I guess it's pretty much the same as the 2007 Pioneer pro from Europe? If it is, the TV has some issues displaying HD pictures because of some inferior scaling but besides that it's a fantastic TV.

I know some have hinted that the G20 should be a new reference. I don't agree. G20 is a very nice TV but no reference. The 2008 Pioneer is definitely better. The 2007 Pio has better internal circuits and Pana can't match that with their mid-end TVs so all in all I think G20 would be a step down for you.
User avatar
By Rasmus Larsen
#1704
brian_p wrote:It seems strange that the G20's black level measured as high as .04 cd/m2. An American pro calibrator just measured the initial minimum luminance of an S2 at .02 cd/m2. (As we now know is typical of Panasonic plasmas, the mll has increased in the hours since that measurement was taken.) What equipment was used to get that measurement of .04 cd/m2? Do you know how many hours the G20 had been on when you measured?
I don't know exactly why but it could be some minor changes between the US and EU models. The difference from .04 to .02 cd/m2 is not huge, though. It's still not KURO blacks.

We use a hardware calibrator that has been re-calibrated by a very expensive calibrator. The hardware has been manufactured by Gretag (Gretacoder Data Systems) and was called eye one pro. Gretag was sold to X-rite some time ago but back in the days I had a chance to go to the Gretag headquarter in Switzerland because my uncle was working there and had a chance to see the differences between different calibrators. I'm not saying that hardcore equipment like the very expensive Minolta is not worth it but the differences are not that huge.
On the other hand I agree that calibrators such as the Spyder should not be used by pros or for graphical work. Calibrators like the Spyder are fine for most consumers but not accurate enough for critical tasks.
I have been working a lot with pro graphic PC monitors as well so I have tried quite a few calibrators over time. I still like my Gretag very much so I have decided to keep that.

I performed several readings. Some in bright daylight, some in our calibration room that is completely dark. The measurement posted in the review has been made in the calibration room. I took some measurements out-of-box (after a short start-up period) and some measurements after about 100 hours. I never made it to 600 hours, though.
I still have the G20 here and it has been running for a long time now so I'm very eager to see if anything changes. Sure, I'll keep you guys updated :)

Also, we used the same calibrator on G10. So you should be able to compare these. It's harder to compare measurements from different calibrators.
User avatar
By Rasmus Larsen
#1705
Crunchie wrote:I was thinking - if I turn up the red, green and blue drive sliders to full (in Professional mode) will this increase the contrast significantly? (it does so on my PX60). I'll try anything to enable me to watch the Professional picture mode(s) in the daytime instead of only being bright enough to watch in a dark room.
Yeah, RGB gain and cutoff will increase light output as well but you will probably also alter the gamma curve. I don't think this is a good idea. You should probably use one of the brighter modes or access the service menu to see if you can increase light output in the professional mode.
By joro_abv
#1852
Rasmus Larsen wrote:
joro_abv wrote:Anyway, there is one absolutely major aspect that need to be considered now, when it comes to Panasonic plasmas - the black levels/automatic voltage adjustment problem of the 2009 range. Obviously it's too early for any observations, but do you have any trustful information on that matter from Panasonic or any other source ?
It seems that it's primarily a US related issue. It's true that plasma panels change in terms of light intensity over time but black levels should only be worsened a tiny bit (theoretically).

There are two aspects; one is the actual change in light output that is reduced over time (LCDs and OLEDs also loose light intensity over time).
Panasonic is trying to compensate by modifying light output based running hour intervals (all manufacturers are, including LG and Samsung). It seems that the backlight stepping is too hard on some sets. Panasonic should probably release a firmware update to fix the too steep 600 hour change. Panasonic told me that the 2010 models have a less aggressive algorithm for changing light output. I don’t know if it’s true but I noticed that the picture menu had a setting called “Panel” that changed nothing. This could be a setting for disabling the algorithm.
The second one is the change over time in phosphor. You can’t really do anything about this but it’s the same issue like on the old CRT TVs.

I have had a 2009 and a 2008 Panasonic plasma here for some time now and see no visible reduction. I also had a 2007 and a 2009 Samsung plasma. Both have been running for some time and I have noticed a minor reduction in light output but no change in black levels.
And about the G20 I haven’t found anything alarming. But I haven’t passed the 600 hour mark yet, so I can’t really say.
Thanks for the detailed explanation and info. I hope there's really nothing to worry about indeed. Still I'll choose when I see both nx800 and v20 review, though :-D.
#1978
I would first like to thank you for all the interesting info posted on the G20.
My problem is common to some other people: I would prefer to wait for the V20 to be available but havent got the time: either I get a new TV or kids & wife will kill me.

My main concern is as regards the connectivity between my MAC and the G20, since I would like to play all data stored in my Mac or External HD on the TV (mp3 files, movies, pictures,........). I want my TV hung on the wall with no cables around and I am specially interested in the DLNA-WIFI-CABLE connections. I have read some compatibility problems, so the questions that arise are:

1.- Can I use my iMac as a DVD reader and stream the info to watch the movie onto the G20 (either wireless or through the corresponding network cable)
2.- What about mp3 files and pictures in say jpg format?
3.- Will the V20 change some of this as compared with the G20?

Thanks for your help.
User avatar
By Rasmus Larsen
#2144
Lucagfc wrote:Hi

I've just bought this 42G20 television and in THX mode I can not find the RGB settings. I need to enter in service menu? thanks
In the setup menu there's an option to enable IFSccc. It's deactivated by default.
By plasmoid
#2256
Thank you very much for the review. At the moment I am also deciding between a V20 and a G20 model. So I'd like to ask you if you have already gotten the V20? :)
By Suchisan
#2264
plasmoid wrote:Thank you very much for the review. At the moment I am also deciding between a V20 and a G20 model. So I'd like to ask you if you have already gotten the V20? :)
Think thats a bit early yet tbh for the V20. ;)
By plasmoid
#2324
Thank you for answering.

Have you got news on the black level rising on the G20? Have you passed the 600h limit?